Quarta-feira, 20 de Agosto de 2008

SUPPORT GEORGIA!

 

 

"Courage is rightly esteemed the first of human qualities... because it is the quality which guarantees all others."
Winston Churchill

 

 

This blog supports GEORGIA / Este blog apoia a GEORGIA

 

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“Georgia did not attack Russia, Russia is attacking Georgia. They say they were protecting their citizens but we heard the same argument from Nazi Germany in taking the Sudetenland in 1938. Formally, Russia says it is protecting its citizens but in reality it is beginning a war.”

publicado por sá morais às 13:57
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De Seraphiel a 20 de Agosto de 2008 às 16:39
I really don't know why anybody should support Georgia. The country is one big US military base. The president is a nutcase being treated with psychiatry many times. Georgia doesn't acknowledge Ossetians for being human. South Ossetia is a nature reserve under planing according to the Georgian government website. As the whole world except the Americans knows, it was Georgia starting the bombing on Tshkinvali. And everybody knows that Russia reacted to that because there were Russians peace-keepers there and all Ossetians living their can only get a Russian passport because the Georgian passports can't be given to animals.


De sá morais a 20 de Agosto de 2008 às 21:37
"The country is one big US military base."

wrong! If they are a US military base where are the american weapons????

That only a cliche...

"As the whole world except the Americans knows"

Many other countries are supporting Georgia! You're wrong again.

"it was Georgia starting the bombing on Tshkinvali."

Because south Ossetia was full of militia armed by the russians

" there were Russians peace-keepers"

We can only call "peace-Keepers" to an independent force in a conflict. The russians where nothing of that kind. They where there defending there interests and getting ready to atack a democratic nation!

"Georgia doesn't acknowledge Ossetians for being human"

Only russian propaganda... Goebbels would have been proud...


De Seraphiel a 21 de Agosto de 2008 às 05:10
"wrong! If they are a US military base where are the american weapons????"
LOL... you didn't know that Georgia buys its weapons from the US, Turky, Ukraine and Israel? You really think Georgia makes weapons themselves? You also don't know that just before the war there was a large military training in Georgia with US troops. The training was called "Rapid response". Do you really think that was for practicing for the war in Iraq???. Do you really think that the increase of the Georgian military budget from 34 million dollars to 1 milliard dollars only means they have peace keeping intentions??? That can only one thing my friend. Georgia preparing for war.

"Many other countries are supporting Georgia! You're wrong again." You are only partially right here. Many countries governments support Georgia. But many of these countries citizens don't. There even was a survey in Germany that stated that the German citizens became more pro russian an more anti american after the start of the war.

"Because south Ossetia was full of militia armed by the russians"
- Wrong. Those are called Russian peace-keepers. The South Ossetian army had a budget of 400 000 dollar. In contrast to Georgia you can hardly call that an army. How many South-Ossetian rocket launchers have you seen? none..... They don't have any.

"We can only call "peace-Keepers" to an independent force in a conflict. The russians where nothing of that kind. They where there defending there interests and getting ready to atack a democratic nation!"
- What the hell did the Georgian peace-keepers do in South Ossetia then? Are you sure they are independent? Didn't Georgia, Russia and FN agreed to have Russian and Georgian peace-keepers in the region?

About south ossetians not being acknowledged... take a tour to the Georgian government website and find out that Souht Ossetia is not on the map. In stead it is a nature reserve.

Looks to me you have heard some flares about all the things happening there, but haven't got a clue what REALLY goes on there.

I rest my case.


De sá morais a 21 de Agosto de 2008 às 14:23
"you didn't know that Georgia buys its weapons from the US, Turky, Ukraine and Israel? You really think Georgia makes weapons themselves?"

LOL and LOL! where did you see those weapons? In dreams? The last time I saw, T-72, BMP's, BTR's were Soviet made!
Israel... they bought 20 rifles... enough to win any war! ahahah!

I think you should learn more about military equipment before saying such nonsense...

"Georgia preparing for war."

Against Russia! A superpower! Yeah! Sure! LOL! suicidal tendences...

"Many countries governments support Georgia. But many of these countries citizens don't."

I garantee that many are supporting Georgia, specially those who suffer at russian hands!
But we dont think all the same way... Thats why even in Russia many people is against Putin.

"a survey in Germany that stated that the German citizens became more pro russian an more anti american after the start of the war."

who made that survey? Pravda?
the germans love the russians, specially since the 40's...


"The South Ossetian army had a budget of 400 000 dollar. "

you mean south ossetia rebel/illegal army...

"What the hell did the Georgian peace-keepers do in South Ossetia then? Are you sure they are independent?"

the georgian forces were in their land, the russian didnt... That´s the diference!

"Souht Ossetia is not on the map. In stead it is a nature reserve. "

Many coutries have reserves... Whats wrong with that?

"Looks to me you have heard some flares about all the things happening there, but haven't got a clue what REALLY goes on there."

Looks to me that you only express an anti-US, anti-west view, repeated time after time... forgetting the REAL events.

I also rest my case.





De Seraphiel a 23 de Agosto de 2008 às 07:03
Just some recent news to read regarding US weapons in Georgia: http://tinyurl.com/6gqnvg
I already know your answer to this one... Russian propaganda from an American news agency. That's fine by me. I wouldn't expect any different.

"War against Russia! A superpower! Yeah! Sure! LOL! suicidal tendences..." - I never wrote that Georgia was planing for war against Russia. You must be seeing ghosts. They were planing for war to take back control over South Ossetia and Abkhazia, like Saakashvili had promised the Georgian people in 2004. He only forgot that there where Russians citizens living there. But in Saakashvili's simple mind, his 'true friends' from the US would help out. Unfortunately he didn't think the whole thing through, because asking the US to fight Russian troops is like starting a bigger crisis. A crisis where all NATO countries would be drawn in to. Do you really think the world thinks Georgia's territorial problems are so important to give up the stability and economic prosperity in western europe and the US? The prove is in the media. When Georgia began shelling Tskhinvali there was focus on Georgians internal conflicts, but as soon as the Russians entered the stage, those territorial conflicts where soon forgotten and there was full focus on Russia against Georgia.



"the georgian forces were in their land, the russian didnt... That´s the diference!"
The Russian peace keeping forces have worked together with the Georigan peace keeping forces under a UN mandate. This means that the interanational community including Georgia accept Russian forces inside Georgian territory for peace keeping purposes. Russia and Georgia have according to the UN also the right to protect their peace keeping forces when necessary.

"Looks to me that you only express an anti-US, anti-west view, repeated time after time... forgetting the REAL events."

My wife and I have been in touch with our Relatives in both Georgia and South Ossetia almost every day since the war. So you suggest that both my South Ossetian and Georgian relatives are lying to us. Well I can live with that then. Guess it is in the nature of the South Ossetian and Georgian people to lie then. If you want you can ask me for their phonenumbers so you can make some more balanced blogpost about the situation there.

Just for curiosity. Can I ask your opinion about the Abkhazian and Ossetian people? And what do you think is the reason that they want to rather join Russia then living together in harmony under the Georgian flag. A serious answer please. An answer like that they are swines that should surrender to Georgian authorities, is not a serious answer.
And a second question. What are your thoughts about Stalin?
And a third question. How old are you?

Thanks


De sá morais a 23 de Agosto de 2008 às 17:58
"He only forgot that there where Russians citizens living there."

I have a number of brazilien and east europe citizens living in my country... Should they claim independence of some province and start a militia? Should they then call military forces of their countries to maintain peace? Dont make me laugh!

"But in Saakashvili's simple mind"

Yep! Putin's mind is much more complex, specially to kill opositors! Don´t make me laugh again!

"My wife and I have been in touch with our Relatives in both Georgia and South Ossetia almost every day since the war"

In Georgia? And they are all pro-russia, I guess... Congratulations! Here we also have some that think we should never had been independent. I call them "vendidos"... An eufemism...

The answer to your first question is simple: You see this war as some kind of freedom war, I see it as a economical motivated war. It´s so... funny that in all your talk you never refer the real issue - the Control of Caspian Energy Resources!!
Do you know what i'm talking about? Your relatives haven´t explained you? Call them!

I'm gonna tell you a little secret: "pipeline that connected Azerbaijan to Turkey, running through Georgia. The pipeline was designed specifically to bypass Russia. More oil and natural gas pipelines are scheduled to be built in Georgia."

Psst! Don't tell yout relatives! Ahaha!


About the second question... Stalin was a crazy ditactor/assassin, just like Hitler or Mao! Happy?

Age?! Oh! You think that age is synonym of wisdom! Uhhhh! And studies? And a PhD? Uhhhhh!
Ugh! Let me tell you that stupidity is independent of age, social condition, color or religion!

Age?!?! Uhhh!
AHAHAH!
Thanks...


De Seraphiel a 24 de Agosto de 2008 às 07:34
"I have a number of brazilien and east europe citizens living in my country... Should they claim independence of some province and start a militia?"
- My friend.... You know nothing of what happened here. South Ossetia wanted to be independent long before they got themselves russian passes. They got Russian passes for only a few years ago. Russia has a law that says that they protect Russians wherever in the world they are. In this case Russian citizens where under attack and Russian law says that Russia is allowed to protect their citizens.

"In Georgia? And they are all pro-russia, I guess... Congratulations! Here we also have some that think we should never had been independent."
- My family living in Georgia are not pro Russian, but they are against Saakashvili. Do you remember the events in autumn 2007 in Tbilisi?? Guess not. There where large demonstrations back then against Saakhasvili. Georgians wanted that he would leave office, because Saakhasvili was more interested in investing all the governments money in its army in stead of in a good economy. My family wants to stay independent from Russia and they want to have peace with South Ossetia. But unfortunately the Saakhasvili wants to have South Ossetia and Abkhazia without Ossetians and Abkhazians. That's why these regions rather want to be with Russia, that also has showed not to care about them (using them for their own plans), but at least treats them with more respect, then the Georgian government.

"he Control of Caspian Energy Resources!!
Do you know what i'm talking about?"
- I know what you are talking about. My relatives are not interested in oil. But NATO and the US are off course. That's why Georgia has to join NATO by all means necessary. The US helps with military support, while the EU puts lots of recourses into Georgian economy. For western Europe and the US it is very important that those oil and gas pipes don't come into the hands of those nasty Russians. Well.... they are lucky if Russia was interested in taking control over an extra 1% of the total oil and gas distribution to the west. It had already invaded the whole of Georgia and threw of Saakashvili from the throne. The only interest Russia has is that it stays calm in the caucasus. And off course they are interested in Georgia not joining NATO. That's why they come in with so much (for russia little) force. To show the world that not the US not Western Europe, but Russia can handle the problems in its own backyard.

Then your next statement is off course, why Russia is still in Georgia and not retreating. Well my friend. With Saakashvili putting so much money in its military the last years. There is enough interests from the Russians to take a closer look at all this equipment and destroy or steal as much of it as possible. Both for their own good and to let Georgia be left with a 'normal' amount of weapons.

The way you answered my questions shows me you don't know enough about this matter to write reasonable blog post about it.
You didn't answer my question about the Souht Ossetian and Abkhazian people. You only refer to a freedom war. That means you don't know who the Ossetians and Abkhazians are and you don't know about their history.
In your second answer I would have expected you to at least come up with the fact that Stalin gave Georgian control over South Ossetia and Abkhazia in the Soviet Times. And that that became the start of conflicts that continue until today. So I guess you don't have enough knowledge about the basis for this conflict.

I'm not claming you are stupid. Though you certainly think I am. It is just that I think you haven't got enough knowledge about the history of this region and the events that happened here and are still hapening. I don't expect you to have traveled to this region almost every year as I do to visit my relatives. But I would at least have expected a more balanced view on the matter if you would have known the facts ad history of this region. In stead of thinking that the only truth comes through CNN for example.

I'm looking forward to continue this conversation with you. Not that I want to convince you that you are wrong, but just to make you more interested in this subject.




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